Thursday, September 25, 2008
Stealing is Wrong...Right?
EDIT: Just so everyone is aware, what follows turned out to be an elaborate and convincing troll. The question, however, is interesting enough to continue exploring.
You ever get that question, about the guy whose wife is dying? The one where there is a doctor who has the medicine to cure her, but he won't sell it for less than a certain price, and the husband can't afford it, so he breaks in and steals it? It's at that point in the scenario where you get asked whether or not his stealing was a justifiable action.
Now, stealing is generally wrong and difficult to justify. I have never seen a justified ninja of a guild bank, and I'm not entirely sure my mind has been changed. However, this thread throws it into a new light.
Basically, a four-year guild founding member, officer and guild leader (all rolled into the same person), was passed over for a Warglaive of Azzinoth to a new, server-transferred applicant in order to complete his set and increase DPS. The guild leader, Aqua, proceeded to take 200k gold from the guild bank and gquit.
But wait, there's more to the story.
You see, the guild he's in, Casual, have been clearing Kil'Jaedan for a while. They cannot progress any farther, and therefore do not especially need an increase in DPS (the speculators in the thread value it at about an extra 200-300 DPS, or 5-10 seconds off a Brutalus kill). Their forays into BT are, on the flipside, for filling in spots in people's gear, probably to keep them busy while waiting for the expansion and for nights on which Sunwell is a cold, empty, boss-less shell.
200k, however, is a lot of gold, and would hurt an entire guild, not just those responsible for the, in my opinion, horrible call to give a two-month unknown a glaive over a 4-year vet. (For those of you wondering, the glaive was not distributed via loot council.)
What follows is a conversation with a fellow blogger and guildmate about the issue, presenting several facets and sides to the argument.
[14:31] Harl: I see petty guild drama so far... what am I looking for?
[14:31] Bellwether: Ha
[14:31] Bellwether: Well, it's kind of the scale of the drama
[14:32] Bellwether: As in, some guild thought a 2 month old app deserved a warglaive over a 4 year officer/guild leader because it would be a "complete set" and would "up dps," but this guild clears KJ every week and cannot progress any farther, so the increase in dps is obviously unnecessary.
[14:33] Harl: I dunno, it doesn't really sound like a very clear-cut issue
[14:33] Harl: and based on the behavior of the former guild leader, i have to think there was gross lack of maturity involved...
[14:34] Bellwether: Well, you have to believe he was doing something right to have a raiding guild last 4 years, be just under the top 50 in the US, and be regularly clearing KJ.
[14:36] Harl: hard to say if it was him or the people he surrounded himself with, though
[14:37] Harl: I mean, I can understand getting fed up enough to quit - I've done that myself. but to ninja the bank and whatnot? that's not what I'd expect out of a high-quality leader
[14:40] Bellwether: True enough, but it's also the scale of things. As in, 1) it's a legendary, which aren't the easiest to come by. 2) It's four years of dedication versus a server-transfer applicant who people have known for two months total. 3) As they regularly kill KJ, an increase in dps is not paramount for guild progression, as the guild can no longer progress.
[14:42] Harl: yeah, all fair points. I guess I feel that his behavior overshadows all of that, though, and puts him clearly in the wrong. you just don't *do* shit like that. esp. as someone in a leadership position
[14:43] Bellwether: (Not saying he's right in what he did)
[14:43] Bellwether: But at the same time, do you just let it go? It's truly a gigantic slap in the face by an organization you've put four years into.
[14:44] Harl: oh, I wouldn't let it go at all. I'd walk. you're right, it's absolutely a bitch-slap. but there are mature ways to deal with it and immature ways to deal with it. he chose poorly ;p
[14:46] Bellwether: He could have done worse. /gdisband? But still, "walking" doesn't really drive the point home at all. He wouldn't get anything, they wouldn't feel a sting (if they're clearing KJ and getting rogue w/ glaive applicants, they can't be hurting badly), and it'd be like they got out of a horrible decision virtually scot-free.
[14:48] Harl: I guess I disagree there. that's a desire for revenge that I hear, which is petty and non-constructive. it's not going to change anything in the end, it makes the perp look like a douche and it ends up hurting a lot of other people (other guildies) that weren't even involved in the drama.
[14:49] Bellwether: I'm still not saying he's right. But walking wouldn't fix anything. It's not, in my opinion, petty to be deeply hurt and angry about a two-month applicant being valued over four years of dedicated service and wanting some sort of restitution. Not saying he went about it the right way. I'm just saying walking wouldn't fix anything.
[14:51] Harl: I guess my point is that there isn't always a way to fix something.
[14:51] Bellwether: There should be.
[14:51] Harl: that's not how reality works
[14:51] Bellwether: Reality sucks.
[14:51] Harl: it has it's moments, true
In the end, both were in the wrong, it's true. Both could have handled it better. But a feeling of betrayal cuts deep, and I can't help but sympathize with how Aqua felt, even if I can't with how he chose to address it.