tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post6821729043909357739..comments2023-07-26T06:20:01.981-04:00Comments on 4 Haelz: Tee-Ball MentalityBellhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13850946760618331779noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-24200374819032531802009-09-02T03:31:32.058-04:002009-09-02T03:31:32.058-04:00Good readGood readThomashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16184775583298245287noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-18211197090981857732009-08-27T11:36:52.296-04:002009-08-27T11:36:52.296-04:00What you say about casual and bad being different ...What you say about casual and bad being different things is completely true. I have played with several people who are really good at their class, but don't have loads of time to spend in game, and their gear and achievements reflect this. In contrast I have played with people who obviously spend a lot of time in game, and have the best gear money & grinding can get them, and are still completely clueless. <br /><br />I don't PUG much anymore, but when I do, I always have to keep my fingers crossed to avoid the people you have described in your post... we all know the type!ArchDruid Angelahttp://www.restorationdruid.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-59076938250577323982009-08-21T08:06:41.379-04:002009-08-21T08:06:41.379-04:00@Hana - I think it's important to do well when...@Hana - I think it's important to do well when you're pugging because you still are having an impact on others' enjoyment. I do not set the bar quite so high (basically, if you are doing decent DPS, if we are not dying, no mob is hitting me in the face, and you're getting out of the fire, you're fine) but I believe there is still a bar. So I think we agree on requiring competence.<br /><br />@Metaphor - Being good at your class and not being able to survive or taxing the healers/tanks/other DPS is just as bad. I was in an OS 25 with a hunter who demanded I heal him through lava walls because then he could do DPS on the boss. He was pretty close to top DPS too. But I refused to heal him. Why? Well, for one thing, he never tried to dodge. For another, we were doing OS 25 with only three healers. I had to prioritize, and he just wasn't worth it.<br /><br />@Alaron - actually, I'm not venting here. It's a topic I've been thinking about for a while, and though you might not be able to tell, I worked off and on with this post for over a week before posting it. I'll be glad to read your view on this!<br /><br />@Anonymous/Verdian - Heroic ToC is the one place I dread pugging. There is the wipe on the first pull, the not turning away on Eadric the Pure, the attacking of the Confessor when the memory is up, the standing in exploding ghouls or poison muck or what have you. It's still surmountable, but man if it isn't hair-pulling painful.<br /><br />@Thedoctorr - I couldn't agree more. That's why, even though it seemed a long shot, I chose Vigilant to app to.Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13850946760618331779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-18258993364463489722009-08-20T23:46:47.733-04:002009-08-20T23:46:47.733-04:00I would say your spot on here.
Vigilant manages i...I would say your spot on here.<br /><br />Vigilant manages it's necessary elitism very well. I had applied at another high end raiding guild about half a year before I apped at Vigilant. The two experiences where quite different and I was talking about this same topic just the other day with a friend.<br /><br />The other guild was by no means "wrong" in their approach and I was/am not angry at them or anything like that, it was just interesting to see the two guilds approaches.<br /><br />The other guild was very quick to reply and ask questions but they knocked back people much quicker and more often. If there were too many of a certain class or the persons gear was not up to scratch they got the DECLINE. <br /><br />When I apped at Vigilant (admittedly more prepared) I expected them to be harsher than or at least as harsh as they are the top ally guild. <br /><br />Not the case.<br /><br />While they had no problems knocking back people who didn't make the cut for the reasons Bell outlined, they did not decline people based on current numbers of that class. Instead the app was given an honest warning that their class/role was full and that joining would mean competing for a raid spot. This to me makes so much sense. Competition breeds excellence. Also, people whose gear was not up to par BUT was gemmed, enchanted correctly were given the opportunity to explain their choices and with Bell as a perfect example, join the guild anyway.<br /><br />The elitism displayed by Vigilant's app process is very well managed and results in a fair go for any competent players to prove themselves and excel. I think this is a good example of where elitism is necessary BUT fair. The word does not always need to inspire negative connotations.Thedoctorrnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-19837308884580954812009-08-20T22:22:59.854-04:002009-08-20T22:22:59.854-04:00All good points.
It breaks my little healer's...All good points.<br /><br />It breaks my little healer's heart when I get called up to PuG some 80s through H ToC - and the DKs still have that 'new-80' smell. Just because it's WoW's latest loot pinata doesn't mean it should be top of your to-do list after the big ding. Especially if you have never done a Northrend instance before. And even more especially, if you won't admit to not knowing the fights.<br /><br />I am always happy to point things out (like run out after the first bosses dismount) but I can't explain things to players who adamantly tell me they know the fights. Even after they get lost coming in. And don't know where to find a lance. And wonder where their action bar suddenly went. By which point you've already started and you may as well finish it. <br /><br />Because if you bail (even after the numerous wipes on the same fights for simple reasons like tanks without threat, or DPS not targeting the tank's target) YOU are the bad guy. You're the jerk, the bitch, the prima donna, the elitist funsucker who hurt some DKs feelings.<br /><br />On the plus side - those people will never ask you to heal, ever ever again.<br /><br />Verdian<br />Resto Drood<br />SaurfangAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-63821967081132490972009-08-20T20:35:16.318-04:002009-08-20T20:35:16.318-04:00Posted my response at http://thefluiddruid.wordpre...Posted my response at http://thefluiddruid.wordpress.com/2009/08/21/standards-vs-elitism/Alaronhttp://thefluiddruid.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-86045712847048860162009-08-20T15:10:53.990-04:002009-08-20T15:10:53.990-04:00Hah! A /vent post cleverly disguised as inventive ...Hah! A /vent post cleverly disguised as inventive commentary! :)<br />Well, /signed, obviously, but I imagine the average WoW blog-reading person isa a bit above the norm, so I don't think you'll get a lot of disagreement. Unfortunately, WOW by itself doesn't give you a lot of tools to teach you how to improve, so many people still have never had that lightbulb moment (I can find out WOW stuff OUTSIDE the game?!?!). <br /><br />You've inspired me to make my own post on this on my blog. I'll link it here in a bit.Alaronhttp://thefluiddruid.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-11513007296845221672009-08-20T14:44:03.017-04:002009-08-20T14:44:03.017-04:00How about people who, will being really good at pl...How about people who, will being really good at playing their class, aren't good players overall? I have had so many groups lately (not all PUGs, my guildies keep pulling this too) where we're clearing trash in a heroic and all of a sudden... two DPSers are afk. At best you get a "be right back" and maybe it's true. Or mana users who refuse to drink between trash fights and so go OOM and start wanding. Look, I get that honeymint tea costs gold. That's why I run my dailies. I don't complain about re-applying GotW every time you wipe us.<br /><br />Or being smart enough to figure out kill order without the icons? You know how much damage you do, you should be able to tell if you're the only DPS'r on a mob. It makes the healer's job way easier when you drop the mobs 1-2-3-4 rather than all at once (and I'm not talking about AOE damage, just single target DPSers who don't play right)<br /><br />Look, I know how DPS-ing instances goes. I have a mage that I love dearly who never gets to come out because the only time I get to run heroics is if I'm healing. It's not that hard. Don't stand in the fire, don't pull aggro, don't wander off to talk to your mom halfway through without telling us!<br /><br />Metaphor<br />Resto Druid<br />GarithosMetaphornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-51963576187521652932009-08-20T13:11:39.875-04:002009-08-20T13:11:39.875-04:00For the most part I agree with the post, especiall...For the most part I agree with the post, especially when it comes to raiding, but when I'm pugging 5-mans (or an easy raid instance) I care less.<br /><br />Not everyone is going to research a spec online. It involves a time investment outside of the game itself. As a raider it's a necessity. But for the person who plays infrequently the thought of reading up on a build might involve a trip to GameFAQs at best.<br /><br />All I ask for a pug is someone to be competant, and depending on the level of difficulty of the instance/raid the competancy bar moves up or down (competancy being a combination of gear and ability to play). For a heroic, the competency level is relatively low. As long as they can follow instructions and do decent dps/healing/tanking it doesn't endanger the group it doesn't matter to me if their spec isn't cookie cutter.Hanahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12020803566446071455noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-29038676750633723182009-08-20T12:18:18.876-04:002009-08-20T12:18:18.876-04:00@valkyrie - I'm sorry you've been stamped ...@valkyrie - I'm sorry you've been stamped that way for asking for people to play well. It can really suck. Glad you enjoyed the post, though!<br /><br />@Kayeri - flatterer<br /><br />@Jong - there is apparently a lot you don't know about me! :P<br /><br />@Anonymous/Treecaller - I would like to think I keep my ego relatively in check; if I thought I was the best of the best, I'd have no reason to improve. I wish you all the luck in your continued WoW playing, and I hope other Druid blogs are more to your taste. :)Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13850946760618331779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-18781388554073805052009-08-20T12:07:11.773-04:002009-08-20T12:07:11.773-04:00Everyone has thier level of play and style. I res...Everyone has thier level of play and style. I respect those who want to be in these cutting edge guilds and explore the content as thoroughly as possible. <br /><br />I do believe you're claim here is correct; in that to participate in such activities you're by default elitist. <br /><br />While I've appreciated and learned from some of your advice on being a resto druid here, as a result of this particular article I'm dropping this site from my RSS feed and daily visit. <br /><br />The ego that comes with elitism is something I refuse to tolerate in my method of game enjoyment. I won't fool myself into ever even thinking I'd raid with a guild such as yours and thankfully both your guild and I would be completely okay with that. <br /><br />Respectfully,<br />Treecaller<br />Resto Druid<br />BloodscalpAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-20076389091890640892009-08-20T11:26:56.148-04:002009-08-20T11:26:56.148-04:00What a scrubbish rogue.
I didn't know you got...What a scrubbish rogue.<br /><br />I didn't know you got into the guild. Belated grats! Hope you fun running with them.Jonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14750329810568222503noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-20141427303954252632009-08-20T10:37:33.654-04:002009-08-20T10:37:33.654-04:00What you are saying is basically, you expect compe...What you are saying is basically, you expect competence in play, gear choices and gems/enchants/glyphs. That would be true of any raiding guild taking in someone for their raid team.<br /><br />Your guild, due to their position and their desire to keep that position, needs more than that... They need the MOST competent players with the gear to match.<br /><br />a few weeks when you applied to Vigilant, you knew you had to have the best stuff... so you re-gemmed, re-enchanted and put yourself in prime condition for the application process. You knew you had to be at your peak for serious consideration.<br /><br />If I were ever to apply to our Vigilant-equivalent, Drow, you bet I'd be looking at their resto druids on the armory, checking them out and comparing them to what I had before I ever put the app in. They are the best for a reason, after all. <br /><br />Too bad this guy wasnt flexible enough to think that way... he might have become a good raid member if he had. And you are right, rejecting someone on that basis is not elitism. A guild like Vigilant demands the best and will only accept that. ::grinning and clapping Bell on the arm::Kayerinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7812976357150095653.post-46506767018203732082009-08-20T09:44:00.077-04:002009-08-20T09:44:00.077-04:00I'm cheering and screaming in fan-girl-gasms. ...I'm cheering and screaming in fan-girl-gasms. Really. And somehow I will not post this to my guild forums, where I've been made out to be the "bitch" and the "elitist" because I expect people I group with in Ulduar to play well. /sigh@valkyrierisenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11958181790385738245noreply@blogger.com